CTS-V Brake Swap

[Matt@DamondMotorsports]

2 weeks

[Djohns]

Hell yea. DM is da man. Any idea on pricing?

[monkey.bones.007]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports 2 weeks

Dual caliper mod? 4 times the braking powwarrrrr!!!!!!!!

crapatalk it sucks for free

[Voltwings]

Originally Posted by monkey.bones.007 Dual caliper mod? 4 times the braking powwarrrrr!!!!!!!! crapatalk it sucks for free

.

[AnimalMother]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports 2 weeks

Finally, I wasn't sure how much longer I could keep the secret in.

[impossible]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports 2 weeks

I see that's a ms6, what about for ms3? Also will a bracket kit be made for the CTS-V 6 pot Brembo calipers from the gen2 V?

[Matt@DamondMotorsports]

Originally Posted by impossible I see that's a ms6, what about for ms3? Also will a bracket kit be made for the CTS-V 6 pot Brembo calipers from the gen2 V?

We'll be test fitting on the MS3 soon. Along with FoRS Brembos(I've had a set on order for awhile). The latter should directly bolt on, but rotors might be a little tricky.

We'll most likely stay away from the 6 pots. Mainly as they're pricey and a bit overkill.

Originally Posted by Djohns Hell yea. DM is da man. Any idea on pricing?

Not yet, but it'll be cheaper and less evasive than putting Evo Brembo's on a MS6

[impossible]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports We'll be test fitting on the MS3 soon. Along with FoRS Brembos(I've had a set on order for awhile). The latter should directly bolt on, but rotors might be a little tricky. We'll most likely stay away from the 6 pots. Mainly as they're pricey and a bit overkill. Not yet, but it'll be cheaper and less evasive than putting Evo Brembo's on a MS6

oh bummer. I see the FoRS Brembos are only around $185 a side and look a little more compact than the v1 CTS-V Brembos. I'm excited for sure about this release, have been waiting so long for someone to make this an option for the MS3's. I'll definitely be buying a bracket/adapter kit when you drop it!

[acidplant]

This is Great news...From Damond MotorSports......I'll keep ah eye for when it is officially out.

[Matt@DamondMotorsports]

Originally Posted by impossible oh bummer. I see the FoRS Brembos are only around $185 a side and look a little more compact than the v1 CTS-V Brembos. I'm excited for sure about this release, have been waiting so long for someone to make this an option for the MS3's. I'll definitely be buying a bracket/adapter kit when you drop it!

I won't know til I get the RS stuff... hopefully this weekend, but I'm pretty sure they're actually gonna be bigger in all dimensions than the CTS-V ones.

The CTS-V calipers are a really good size for this cars, all in piston sizes and we're using a rotor that should match them very well.

Doing the 6-pots could potentially negatively effect braking performance, and the cost is high, so we're staying away from those.

[ChaunceyM]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports We'll be test fitting on the MS3 soon. Along with FoRS Brembos(I've had a set on order for awhile). The latter should directly bolt on, but rotors might be a little tricky. We'll most likely stay away from the 6 pots. Mainly as they're pricey and a bit overkill. Not yet, but it'll be cheaper and less evasive than putting Evo Brembo's on a MS6

What rotors would you be using on the Gen2? I'd love to get something beefier than stock to help deal with the heat on the track. Any chance you're also working on a adapter to mount up some cooling ducts to the knuckle....

[Tokay444]

I have the ATS setup ready to go for my FR-S.
nothing constructive to add to the thread though, feggits.

[Matt@DamondMotorsports]

Originally Posted by ChaunceyM What rotors would you be using on the Gen2? I'd love to get something beefier than stock to help deal with the heat on the track. Any chance you're also working on a adapter to mount up some cooling ducts to the knuckle....

No idea yet. We'll know soon enough once we start playing around with test fitting. We plan on using the rotor thickness the CTS-V calipers were intended to, like we have on the 6. And the rotors we're using there have directional vanes, so added bonus!

Actually waiting on some ducting to arrive in a couple days.

[Djohns]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports No idea yet. We'll know soon enough once we start playing around with test fitting. We plan on using the rotor thickness the CTS-V calipers were intended to, like we have on the 6. And the rotors we're using there have directional vanes, so added bonus! Actually waiting on some ducting to arrive in a couple days.

Lemme know if I can lend a hand on test fitting or anything.

[DougNuts]

I'm interested in a set of brackets for a Mazda3/5. I had a CTS-V a few years ago and the brakes were one of the best parts about that car. Where are you guys purchasing the calipers from? Ironically, since it was cheap, I had purchased a spare caliper back when I had the car but now forgot where I got it from.

Edit: N/M, I just ordered a set from RockAuto. Hopefully someone comes through with a bracket.

[MoMS3]

Originally Posted by DougNuts I'm interested in a set of brackets for a Mazda3/5. I had a CTS-V a few years ago and the brakes were one of the best parts about that car. Where are you guys purchasing the calipers from? Ironically, since it was cheap, I had purchased a spare caliper back when I had the car but now forgot where I got it from.

Check out amazon, they've got them for about $150 per caliper. I think they're bare aluminium, so may or may not match what you've got already.

[DougNuts]

Originally Posted by MoMS3 I don't think they'd be able to use the same brackets given that the 4 piston setup specs a 12.75" rotor vs 6 piston on 14" rotor, to me it would seem the brackets would mount the 6 piston caliper further out from the hub to accommodate the .625" increase in radius of the rotor. Not to mention the mounting points for the 6 piston look completely different in their location

Responding to a few months old post.......

The 4 piston (1st Gen) CTS-V uses 14" rotors (355x30mm) and the 6 piston (2nd Gen) CTS-V uses 15" rotors (370x34mm). The calipers are interchangeable on the CTS-V assuming you use bigger rotors, so the additional radial spacing is designed into the caliper.

[MoMS3]

Originally Posted by DougNuts Responding to a few months old post....... The 4 piston (1st Gen) CTS-V uses 14" rotors (355x30mm) and the 6 piston (2nd Gen) CTS-V uses 15" rotors (370x34mm). The calipers are interchangeable on the CTS-V assuming you use bigger rotors, so the additional radial spacing is designed into the caliper.

That is correct, however I was referring to the rotor sizes used by those who were installing on Nissan/Subaru applications. The thing with our situation is we don't share the same geometry on our steering knuckle as the CTS-V (I'd assume its the same across the board for the CTS), and as a result we can't simply upsize the rotor diameter.

For our application we have a lot more variables to take into account due to the fact we are using random rotors that have similar dimensions to the CTS-V rotors. So while we may be able to adapt a bigger rotor for 6 piston, the offset may be such that a different bracket is required for everything to line up properly. In other words, the radial spacing isn't really the main issue here. Plus based on what Matt said, it sounds like the 6-piston calipers aren't going to play nice with the brake bias on our car.

I personally hope that the FoRS calipers work out for our car since they're monoblock design, and should in theory have minimal adaptation required to fit the MS3.

[DougNuts]

I'm ready.

[JakeMS3]

I've missed so much over the last year. So ready for this!

[DougNuts]

Anyone hear of any progress on someone making an adapter for CTS-V or RS calipers?

Has anyone looked at the RS calipers or have a link to where someone has and shared what they saw? I'd would be great if we could just buy this kit, find some similar rotors with the correct bolt pattern and bolt it on: http://www.cjponyparts.com/ford-perf...2017/p/M2300W/

[Djohns]

Originally Posted by DougNuts Anyone hear of any progress on someone making an adapter for CTS-V or RS calipers? Has anyone looked at the RS calipers or have a link to where someone has and shared what they saw? I'd would be great if we could just buy this kit, find some similar rotors with the correct bolt pattern and bolt it on: http://www.cjponyparts.com/ford-perf...2017/p/M2300W/

This thread kinda outlines that DM is working on it....

[Matt@DamondMotorsports]

Originally Posted by DougNuts Anyone hear of any progress on someone making an adapter for CTS-V or RS calipers? Has anyone looked at the RS calipers or have a link to where someone has and shared what they saw? I'd would be great if we could just buy this kit, find some similar rotors with the correct bolt pattern and bolt it on: http://www.cjponyparts.com/ford-perf...2017/p/M2300W/

We'll be getting another trackday of testing tomorrow, last time was wet, so we weren't able to fully thrash the brakes. We're also playing around with the ATS calipers after seeing how inexpensive those are. We're going to start test fitting and mocking up for the 3 next week.



The RS brake will bolt right up... after the knuckle mounting points are bored, and getting the rotor machined for the correct hub bore and bolt pattern. Do that and it's direct fitment. Also buying all the parts separately, RS kit is around $600

[Djohns]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports We'll be getting another trackday of testing tomorrow, last time was wet, so we weren't able to fully thrash the brakes. We're also playing around with the ATS calipers after seeing how inexpensive those are. We're going to start test fitting and mocking up for the 3 next week. The RS brake will bolt right up... after the knuckle mounting points are bored, and getting the rotor machined for the correct hub bore and bolt pattern. Do that and it's direct fitment. Also buying all the parts separately, RS kit is around $600

Will those fit a 16" wheel?

[MoMS3]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports We'll be getting another trackday of testing tomorrow, last time was wet, so we weren't able to fully thrash the brakes. We're also playing around with the ATS calipers after seeing how inexpensive those are. We're going to start test fitting and mocking up for the 3 next week. The RS brake will bolt right up... after the knuckle mounting points are bored, and getting the rotor machined for the correct hub bore and bolt pattern. Do that and it's direct fitment. Also buying all the parts separately, RS kit is around $600

I take it there aren't any 5x114.3 rotors out there that can be adapted? I've done the redrill rotors in the past, granted that was taking a 5 lug to 4 lug. I was always concerned that adding those extra holes could turn the hub of the rotor into a weak point, granted I'm sure that the planets would need to be aligned and pigs to sprout wings before any sort of catastrophic failure occured.

[mituc]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports The RS brake will bolt right up... after the knuckle mounting points are bored, and getting the rotor machined for the correct hub bore and bolt pattern. Do that and it's direct fitment. Also buying all the parts separately, RS kit is around $600

Well, in this case I guess we can use some of the aftermarket large brake disks (330+mm) for the mazdaspeed and Focus RS/ST (gen2) platform. And of course use some brake pads that will fit.
If the RS brakes will clear some winter 17" wheels I have these may become a pretty good option.

[Matt@DamondMotorsports]

Originally Posted by Djohns Will those fit a 16" wheel?

hahahahahaha... no

Hell, they won't clear any 17's that I know of.

Originally Posted by MoMS3 I take it there aren't any 5x114.3 rotors out there that can be adapted? I've done the redrill rotors in the past, granted that was taking a 5 lug to 4 lug. I was always concerned that adding those extra holes could turn the hub of the rotor into a weak point, granted I'm sure that the planets would need to be aligned and pigs to sprout wings before any sort of catastrophic failure occured.

I'm sure there might be a rotor that could work. I haven't done much searching for a 5x114 rotor that would work with RS calipers.

[ChaunceyM]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports We'll be getting another trackday of testing tomorrow, last time was wet, so we weren't able to fully thrash the brakes. We're also playing around with the ATS calipers after seeing how inexpensive those are. We're going to start test fitting and mocking up for the 3 next week.

I'm really looking forward to the track report on these. Especially if you can run them hard for 20-25 without boiling fluid. My wilwoods and stock-sized DBA rotors are like tiny suns that can boil any fluid.

[Djohns]

Originally Posted by Matt@DamondMotorsports hahahahahaha... no Hell, they won't clear any 17's that I know of. I'm sure there might be a rotor that could work. I haven't done much searching for a 5x114 rotor that would work with RS calipers.

Oh. My bad, I guess I misjudged that picture. At first glance those looked like 17" wheels, I thought the tire wall was taller than it actually is.

[HardCruise]

Any updates for speed 3s


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[Bexar]

Interested for MS3 - it's been a few months !

[MoMS3]

Two weeks...but seriously, I'm also interested for MS3 now I can't run RS brakes.

[Bexar]

Originally Posted by MoMS3 Two weeks...but seriously, I'm also interested for MS3 now I can't run RS brakes.

So was the conclusion that MS3 and MS6 can run RS calipers as a bolt on with a fitted rotor ?
And you can't run RS brakes due to wheel fitment or something?

[mituc]

Originally Posted by Bexar And you can't run RS brakes due to wheel fitment or something?

FoRS brakes = direct bolt-on.
FoRS brake disks = need to be drilled. There is no known 5x114.3 alternative to them so far to match the calliper offset and then our hubs.

And even if the FoRS hubs are also a direct bolt-on I don't think too many people would consider this as an alternative because by this time pretty much everyone is done with the wheel setups (rims, tires) and selling their beloved rims just to get some 5x108 may not be that easy.

[tmillner]

Originally Posted by mituc FoRS brakes = direct bolt-on. FoRS brake disks = need to be drilled. There is no known 5x114.3 alternative to them so far to match the calliper offset and then our hubs. And even if the FoRS hubs are also a direct bolt-on I don't think too many people would consider this as an alternative because by this time pretty much everyone is done with the wheel setups (rims, tires) and selling their beloved rims just to get some 5x108 may not be that easy.

So getting the rotors drilled to the 5x114.3 pattern?

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[MoMS3]

Originally Posted by Bexar So was the conclusion that MS3 and MS6 can run RS calipers as a bolt on with a fitted rotor ? And you can't run RS brakes due to wheel fitment or something?

Can't speak for the MS6, I think those are going to require you to go the route of adapter brackets and cts-v setup. The reason the MS3/FoRS interchangeability is due to the shared platform/similarity of steering knuckle, you just have to drill the rotor to 5x114.3. According to Matt@Damond, the RS brakes are too big to fit in a 17" rim, mainly due to disc size (FoRS has 19" stock).

Originally Posted by mituc FoRS brakes = direct bolt-on. FoRS brake disks = need to be drilled. There is no known 5x114.3 alternative to them so far to match the calliper offset and then our hubs. And even if the FoRS hubs are also a direct bolt-on I don't think too many people would consider this as an alternative because by this time pretty much everyone is done with the wheel setups (rims, tires) and selling their beloved rims just to get some 5x108 may not be that easy.

Not quite direct bolt-on for the calipers, as the Brembos have a larger mounting bolt, requiring the caliper mounting holes to be bored out a bit larger.

Originally Posted by tmillner So getting the rotors drilled to the 5x114.3 pattern? Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

Yeah, essentially you're increasing the size of the hole on the outer tangent by 3.15mm so it will be slightly oblong, but provided the machine shop does a good job assuring they drilled concentric to hub, there should be no ill effects

[tmillner]

Originally Posted by MoMS3 Can't speak for the MS6, I think those are going to require you to go the route of adapter brackets and cts-v setup. The reason the MS3/FoRS interchangeability is due to the shared platform/similarity of steering knuckle, you just have to drill the rotor to 5x114.3. According to Matt@Damond, the RS brakes are too big to fit in a 17" rim, mainly due to disc size (FoRS has 19" stock). Not quite direct bolt-on for the calipers, as the Brembos have a larger mounting bolt, requiring the caliper mounting holes to be bored out a bit larger. Yeah, essentially you're increasing the size of the hole on the outer tangent by 3.15mm so it will be slightly oblong, but provided the machine shop does a good job assuring they drilled concentric to hub, there should be no ill effects

The calipers aren't really that cheap almost doesnt seem worth the hassle

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[Bexar]

Originally Posted by tmillner The calipers aren't really that cheap almost doesnt seem worth the hassle

Right but at least the idea is cool.

Which comes full circle to the cheaper CTS/ATS/GM whatever calipers being a more viable option. I would love a set of yellow calipers on the speed.

[MoMS3]

Originally Posted by tmillner The calipers aren't really that cheap almost doesnt seem worth the hassle Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

Yeah CTS-V calipers are cheaper, but without a bracket, MS3 isn't going to be able to fit them in situ. The main advantage with the FoRS is bigger rotor vs CTS-V setup, and the fact the calipers bolt up after boring out the steering knuckle mounting point.

If DM is going to be designing a bracket for the MS3 then I'd say absolutely go that route, but if they're only designing brackets for the MS6, then us MS3 guys are SOL.

Originally Posted by Bexar Right but at least the idea is cool. Which comes full circle to the cheaper CTS/ATS/GM whatever calipers being a more viable option. I would love a set of yellow calipers on the speed.

Well if you're talking about the yellow 6-piston calipers, those are $310 apiece vs $100-150...that said, most of the 4-piston come bare metal, so that means you can powder coat them as you see fit.

[tmillner]

I had the wilwood 4 piston calipers and the bracket was very basic. Nothing I couldn't have made, I'm tempted to get the ctsv calipers and make a bracket myself

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