GB: GROUND CONTROL + KONI SPORT Coilovers for Mazdaspeed 3!

[timmcc02]

The only thing im worried about is front camber going too negative without camber plates. Anyone have any idea on what to expect front camber to be with using the oem top hats

[KevinK2]

One very good point on this kit, vs some others including Bilsteins, is that they appear to come with a visable compression bump cushion inside the spring, and on the shock rod. This provides a stiffer net spring as you experience high compression of the spring. This "soft" stop is better than going into coil-bind "hard impact" stop as some have experienced with the Bilstein PSS kits. They may actually be designed for the lighter Mazda3, and have an internal bump stop, but it has not prevented coil bind up front in a few applications.

Note that the GC/Koni bump cushion is designed for a specific range of drop. This part may require modification, depending on drop used.

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[Steezyms3]

Originally Posted by gingermike this isn't really a kit you'll want to "slam". there's a pretty obvious point where the ride becomes terrible and bouncy, and that's the suspension's way of saying "raise it back up, junior". Happened with GC's on my old b18 civic. Once I brought it back up a little bit, the ride was awesome and the handling was fantastic.

How low was your EK at the time?

[skiptowncat]

Ok, last question...how much to ship to the uk? I may be able to get a few more onboard

[RPM]

Originally Posted by skiptowncat Ok, last question...how much to ship to the uk? I may be able to get a few more onboard

The box for the complete kit weighs 42 lbs. and is 31" x 16" x 14". We would need postal codes to get quotes from FedEx. You might also look into using a forwarder like USA Address & Mail Forwarding ? Shipito.com | English as they tend to offer very low rates.

[justinsane87]

Originally Posted by RPM The box for the complete kit weighs 42 lbs. and is 31" x 16" x 14". We would need postal codes to get quotes from FedEx. You might also look into using a forwarder like USA Address & Mail Forwarding ? Shipito.com | English as they tend to offer very low rates.

Just tried out that site, it would cost $90 compared to the $220 on your site to ship to Edmonton.

[RPM]

Originally Posted by justinsane87 Just tried out that site, it would cost $90 compared to the $220 on your site to ship to Edmonton.

Yeah.. They have some pretty insane pricing through TNT.. Sometimes we can get close by calling FedEx for special rates, but we need the postal code to get a quote.

[skiptowncat]

Originally Posted by RPM The box for the complete kit weighs 42 lbs. and is 31" x 16" x 14". We would need postal codes to get quotes from FedEx. You might also look into using a forwarder like USA Address & Mail Forwarding ? Shipito.com | English as they tend to offer very low rates.

Try wn1 2ta @RPM;

[Chimmike]

Originally Posted by justinsane87 Just tried out that site, it would cost $90 compared to the $220 on your site to ship to Edmonton.

seems like $220 would be some sort of express shipping? That seems INSANELY high for ground shipping

[justinsane87]

Originally Posted by gingermike seems like $220 would be some sort of express shipping? That seems INSANELY high for ground shipping

That was the cheapest option on their site, kind of redonkulous


Sent from the flux capacitor

[covelife1016]

11 days left. I can't wait to get these on the car.

[Mattyhawk1]

Originally Posted by timmcc02 The only thing im worried about is front camber going too negative without camber plates. Anyone have any idea on what to expect front camber to be with using the oem top hats

The max static negative camber that the front can be set is about -1.5* to -1.9* with no modifications to the strut tower. You will not notice a big difference in camber if you set the top hat back to the original position after install. You will need an alignment anytime you change ride height, since toe changes significantly when raising or lowering the suspension, so you can get camber put to your specs.

You shouldn't be worried about too much negative camber with this setup. If anything, most worry about not enough.

[Mattyhawk1]

Originally Posted by RPM I agree. I tried to get this information out of them, but they just kept saying, "We base it on the individual customer's needs". I finally asked them what information they needed to best design a kit and they told me intended use, ride feel, and weight. The exact wording of the options I made up myself. The most I could get out of them is that the range is 450-650 lb/in in the front and 500-800 lb/in in the rear. With that in mind, at least we know that Daily Driver, Touring is at the low end and Dedicated, Race is at the top...

Out of curiousity, you have an option for using stock shocks for the coilovers only, right? You state in the first post that they are 15% stiffer, is that stiffer than stock? Your response earlier suggests the only option is 450 / 500 as the softest. That will definitely be too much spring for stock shocks. Is this 450/500 meant to apply to the stock shock coilover only option?

I have to caveat all my suspension mod decisions with "Wife Approved". 450/500 will be husband abused...

[gmoney542]

Originally Posted by Mattyhawk1 Out of curiosity, you have an option for using stock shocks for the coilovers only, right? You state in the first post that they are 15% stiffer, is that stiffer than stock? Your response earlier suggests the only option is 450 / 500 as the softest. That will definitely be too much spring for stock shocks. Is this 450/500 meant to apply to the stock shock coilover only option? I have to caveat all my suspension mod decisions with "Wife Approved". 450/500 will be husband abused...

I believe those numbers are only for the KONIs. The ranges he posted are what Ground Control says the KONI Yellows can handle without being revalved.

I doubt the springs for the stock shock option will be anywhere near as stiff.

[Mattyhawk1]

Originally Posted by gmoney542 I believe those numbers are only for the KONIs. The ranges he posted are what Ground Control says the KONI Yellows can handle without being revalved. I doubt the springs for the stock shock option will be anywhere near as stiff.

I think you are right, but I want to hear it from RPM's lips before I order.

[RPM]

Originally Posted by Mattyhawk1 Out of curiousity, you have an option for using stock shocks for the coilovers only, right? You state in the first post that they are 15% stiffer, is that stiffer than stock? Your response earlier suggests the only option is 450 / 500 as the softest. That will definitely be too much spring for stock shocks. Is this 450/500 meant to apply to the stock shock coilover only option? I have to caveat all my suspension mod decisions with "Wife Approved". 450/500 will be husband abused...

If you order the kit for the Stock shocks, the spring rates will be 15% over stock, as that's the most the stock dampers can handle. The higher range is what they use for KONIs.

[KevinK2]

Originally Posted by RPM Ground Control kits consist of a set of Eibach Springs and an anodized aluminum adjuster that provide a drop adjustment range from 0 to 1.6 inches ............. This combination of Ground Control and KONI remains very popular among daily drivers and track enthusiasts in a wide range of markets. And now, they can be yours!

Do you have any concern about how the drop chosen changes the point where the bump cushion is engaged?

It's somewhat similar to just adding drop springs and being instructed to cut one ring off the OEM bump cushions. The lower the drop, the sooner the bump cushion will be engaged. With the front m-struts, the motion ratio is high, so you are seeing close to that drop at the shock.

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[RPM]

Originally Posted by KevinK2 Do you have any concern about how the drop chosen changes the point where the bump cushion is engaged? It's somewhat similar to just adding drop springs and being instructed to cut one ring off the OEM bump cushions. The lower the drop, the sooner the bump cushion will be engaged. With the front m-struts, the motion ratio is high, so you are seeing close to that drop at the shock. .

Ground Control includes a relatively small bump stop. The purpose of this bump stop is just to prevent bottoming out. With the travel provided by the KONIs in addition to the increased spring rates, you would have to do some pretty crazy stuff to bottom out, even at the lowest drop.

[Mattyhawk1]

Originally Posted by KevinK2 Do you have any concern about how the drop chosen changes the point where the bump cushion is engaged? It's somewhat similar to just adding drop springs and being instructed to cut one ring off the OEM bump cushions. The lower the drop, the sooner the bump cushion will be engaged. With the front m-struts, the motion ratio is high, so you are seeing close to that drop at the shock. .

Just FYI on the Koni Yellows, By my experience, you can safely cut up to 40% length off a new OEM front bumpstop and not have issues with running out of shock stroke. I doubt you will have problems with the lowest height settings, especially if you are running the heavier springs.

[Chimmike]

Originally Posted by KevinK2 Do you have any concern about how the drop chosen changes the point where the bump cushion is engaged? It's somewhat similar to just adding drop springs and being instructed to cut one ring off the OEM bump cushions. The lower the drop, the sooner the bump cushion will be engaged. With the front m-struts, the motion ratio is high, so you are seeing close to that drop at the shock. .

don't know if you've ever used GC's and aftermarket shocks before, but GC the setup pretty much reaches a point in lowering where it tells you, via the ride, that you've gone too low. Ride gets stiff, jouncy. Raise up a little from that point and everything smooths out beautifully, you retain fantastic handling, and the longevity of the shocks is kept intact. Therefore, bumpstop shouldn't be an issue.

[KevinK2]

Originally Posted by gingermike don't know if you've ever used GC's and aftermarket shocks before, but GC the setup pretty much reaches a point in lowering where it tells you, via the ride, that you've gone too low. Ride gets stiff, jouncy. Raise up a little from that point and everything smooths out beautifully, you retain fantastic handling, and the longevity of the shocks is kept intact. Therefore, bumpstop shouldn't be an issue.

No on the GC's, but yes on the Koni yellows that are great, adjustable shocks.

I agree with rpm's reply that the koni and stiff spring combo should not be an issue. But with just the 15% stiffer springs, IMHO they should be verified to contribute when running little drop.

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[Canuck]

Originally Posted by RPM Let's try this... @gingermike, @smoogs12, @Mpettograsso, @nybe0010, @rustysurfsa, @mrshoulders, @covelife1016, @Mike@Stratified, @IMASA, @skiptowncat, @easy, @Dumbguy, @Elvisrosales88, @Adog35, @gmoney542, @Hal, @Canuck Ordering instructions are in the first post! We can't even consider beginning to ship until we get the orders in!

I will put my order in during the last weekend of the month.

[Mattyhawk1]

Originally Posted by KevinK2 No on the GC's, but yes on the Koni yellows that are great, adjustable shocks. I agree with rpm's reply that the koni and stiff spring combo should not be an issue. But with just the 15% stiffer springs, IMHO they should be verified to contribute when running little drop. .

You know, that is an excellent question. I have no numbers or experience to back this claim, but I bet you cannot comfortably run full drop on the DD setup for stock springs, which I believe you are alluding to. You will end up spending most of your time on the bumpstops.

[RPM]

Originally Posted by Mattyhawk1 You know, that is an excellent question. I have no numbers or experience to back this claim, but I bet you cannot comfortably run full drop on the DD setup for stock springs, which I believe you are alluding to. You will end up spending most of your time on the bumpstops.

Well, a 1.6" drop isn't any more than what people are getting with other lowering springs, like Eibach Pro-Kit. In fact some people go even lower with TEINs and such, though I certainly wouldn't recommend that.

[Adog35]

Placing order today.
Need to talk to you about spring rates.

[KevinK2]

Originally Posted by RPM Well, a 1.6" drop isn't any more than what people are getting with other lowering springs, like Eibach Pro-Kit. In fact some people go even lower with TEINs and such, though I certainly wouldn't recommend that.

The point is not the 1.6" drop, but the range of drop allowed:

Originally Posted by RPM Ground Control kits consist of a set of Eibach Springs and an anodized aluminum adjuster that provide a drop adjustment range from 0 to 1.6 inches .............

With spring kits having the drops lower than the prokit, experience has found that reducing the length of the bump springs/cushions was needed, at least in the M6 world.

I am not condeming this combination of high quality components. Just suggesting that you may quickly verify they can do what's advertised to do. Your company is certainly qualified to do a verification, when you have had great designs:

RPM-Street-Lowering-Springs-for-Mazdaspeed

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[RPM]

Originally Posted by KevinK2 The point is not the 1.6" drop, but the range of drop allowed: With spring kits having the drops lower than the prokit, experience has found that reducing the length of the bump springs/cushions was needed, at least in the M6 world. I am not condeming this combination of high quality components. Just suggesting that you may quickly verify they can do what's advertised to do. Your company is certainly qualified to do a verification, when you have had great designs: RPM-Street-Lowering-Springs-for-Mazdaspeed .

Well, that's true. In the case that you are using the stock shocks and dropping more than 3/4", you should always cut the "section" off of the bump stop to allow for more travel or replace them with smaller bump stops. This is true of all lowering springs on stock shocks, including the ones we offered for the MS6.

Originally Posted by Adog35 Placing order today. Need to talk to you about spring rates.

I'll have to get back to you on Monday. Lots of family time this weekend due to Easter.

[covelife1016]

Will Ground Control let us know what spring rates they send us? I answered the questions on the site when checking out since I am not a huge guru on spring rates. It would be helpful for in the future if I decide to change the spring rates up.

[RPM]

Originally Posted by covelife1016 Will Ground Control let us know what spring rates they send us? I answered the questions on the site when checking out since I am not a huge guru on spring rates. It would be helpful for in the future if I decide to change the spring rates up.

Of course! The springs will be marked with the spring rates.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

[RPM]

Up to 7 orders! Just over a week left!

[Chimmike]

Putting in my order today. The sooner I can get these things the better!

[Chimmike]

Come on guys! Put in your orders! the sooner, the faster they'll ship!

[RPM]

We're up to 10 now!

[Dumbguy]

Yes sir @gingermike sir. Just put in the order. Now to order camber arms and a skid plate :3 amped...

[gmoney542]

I put my order in last night. Can't wait to get these!

[yourname2221]

paiiiiidddddd

[timmcc02]

What are you guys gonna run for camber arms? I'm up in the air about either spc or corksport

[therza2169]

Originally Posted by timmcc02 What are you guys gonna run for camber arms? I'm up in the air about either spc or corksport

I plan on going with JBR personally.

[timmcc02]

Originally Posted by therza2169 I plan on going with JBR personally.

Love jbr's stuff but I'm not going to buy camber arms that you cant adjust on the car

[therza2169]

Originally Posted by timmcc02 Love jbr's stuff but I'm not going to buy camber arms that you cant adjust on the car

Hmmm you might have a point there. I don't need my alignment guy hating me anymore lol.