Bnr s3 build finished with results looking for any advice

[Brando]

So just wrapped up the BNR s3 build and after a half day of dyno tuning the tuner said he seemed like it was struggling to build more boost. In all honesty, I was expecting more hp out of it but I'd like your guys opinion.
Build specs:
Gen 1 car
2010 gen 2 motor
BNR s3 turbo
Corksport TMIC
Corksport intake 2.6" or so
Ultimate racing catted downpipe and resonated test pipe and stock catback
Cobb 3 port ecbs
3 bar map sensor
autotech hpfp internals
Tuned on 92 octane
82 degrees and high 40s humidity

[knocturnal]

Good job on finishishing your build buy I personally think you should get one of the E tuners to step in because i am not even on BT status and i am making more. I think there is more power to be found and you will be happier in the end. How does the car feel though?

[TiGraySpeed6]

based solely on the graphs posted you've got a ton of power still available.

Was the tuner a local dyno shop, or one of our well known e-tuners?
Did they offer any suggestions on what they felt was preventing boost from being generated?
Do you know the WG spring pressure?
How is the EBCS configured?
Is the engine healthy? Good compression?
Was KR preventing running higher boost, or just not generating boost pressure?

Is the map locked, or can you open it in ATR? If not locked attach a copy of the map for review, and a couple of logs would help too.

[MD1032]

I'd say that's a pretty reasonable result for 92 octane pump gas with your mods, especially during the summer. If you added a little E85 or methanol, you'd see some pretty large gains.

The only thing I see that worries me is the technician remarking that the BNR is struggling to build boost. This turbo should be able to hold 22+ psi to redline, even more if you have a catless, free-flowing exhaust. Take a 4th gear datalog and post it here, I'd be interested to take a look.

[wes3id]

a bigger intake would probably help out. you will max max out your MAF voltage pretty quick with a 2.6", i'd suggest a tru 3.5" intake. when i first got my S3, i had a POS sure full3 aeros and it maxed out on the first revision of tuning. Got a JBR 3.5" and havn't looked back...on 93 pump i was pushing 340 awhp @ 24psi, 25% E85 375 awhp @ 24psi. you definitively have some room to grow.

[sheston]

You should figure out (like said above by @TiGraySpeed6 if the tuner has experience with this platform. At those boost levels, it looks like you may still have the stock K04 in there. The e-tuners recommended on here have shown much better, reliable results, or you should read up how to slowly increase your levels yourself

[impossible]

Shit tuner and not so good mod combination is why you couldn't even make 300whp... TMIC on a gen1? Stock diameter intake on a 2871r and it looks like you joined 2 months ago so this is what lack of research does for you. This powerband would likely get gapped by a FBO E85 K04 car tbh. Taking your money and throwing it off of a cliff makes more sense than your current build, hope you do utilize the forums and make the power your setup is capable of.

[Brando]

Originally Posted by impossible Shit tuner and not so good mod combination is why you couldn't even make 300whp... TMIC on a gen1? Stock diameter intake on a 2871r and it looks like you joined 2 months ago so this is what lack of research does for you. This powerband would likely get gapped by a FBO E85 K04 car tbh. Taking your money and throwing it off of a cliff makes more sense than your current build, hope you do utilize the forums and make the power your setup is capable of.

Thanks bro! It's funny how there's always a grumpy bitch on every forum lol. Assuming will always get you in trouble. For the record I pickup up the car with a blown motor for 2k and 100k miles on it. It CAME with the corksport intake so this is a "starting point". I picked up the corksport tmic for $250 used and that is far from being the bottle neck here. I've got less money in this car TOTAL then most people buying there's stock so no, not throwing any $$ off the cliff just yet. Thanks though. And yes, there has been a tremendous amount of research already done to get to this point. The dyno dynamics is also known as the "heartbreak" dyno because it typically reads pretty low but is great for tuning purposes.
To all the rest of the above posts thanks! I'll try and post the current map and see if it's locked etc and I appreciate the comments! I agree there seems like there should be a lot left in the turbo here. Just need to work on one thing at a time.
I'll work on a 4th gear pull log and see where it's at.
Much appreciated guys!!

[Brando]

Tuner was local shop DB performance in Rogers, MN. They have worked with a few ms3's but don't think that is their bread and butter. I didn't get much for recommendations on freeing up more power. Just possibly the stock cat back or intake. From reading though it seems our catback is not all that restrictive so for now I have left it there. Possibly the intake? I didn't know about the wg screw until after the tune. Not sure what it was factory set at and am wondering if a couple of turns of "the nut" could really be a game changer?

[TiGraySpeed6]

Well, it's reasonably common to run the initial tuning logs for a newly installed turbo using zero wgdc, or just on spring pressure only, to see how much boost is generated on spring only, and how it behaves to be sure it's well behaved. From that you can also extrapolate that peak easy boost to be very roughly double the spring pressure. So, if you learn that your spring pressure is low at only ~9psi, then your 18psi and "hard to build beyond that" would be explained and a potential route to resolve it. However if you find that spring pressure is closer to 14 that's not your issue.

Good info to have from the outset of the tuning process. It also lets you verify the engine and base tune parameters are safe & correct prior to turning up the pressure.

Your intake isn't helping, but it's hardly the primary issue. When the time comes tho a 3.5" intake is a great match to that turbo.

If that dyno is a known heart breaker it may not be unusual to add ~25hp to your ballpark power number. Certainly makes things less depressing.

As for the peak boost, and problems exceeding 18psi, I'm more wondering if the shop gave you any indication of problems- was it running clean, i.e.: no KR, or were there clear limiting factors they didn't want to exceed. That is, did they say what they felt the problem(s) was/were? Typically a decent shop will offer reasons and suggest resolutions for you to decide what's next.

[Brando]

Thanks. I'll give the shop a call. They are a great shop in general and have a very good reputation in the twin cities here. I'm sure the tuner could offer some pointers. Part of the problem is I didn't ask the right questions etc either. And, being they don't do a lot of ms3's that doesn't help. I am seeing boost in the 19.5 area but never touched 20psi.

[mituc]

Logs, please.

[Brando]

Here's the date logs form a few 4th gear pulls.

[Brando]

Originally Posted by TiGraySpeed6 based solely on the graphs posted you've got a ton of power still available. Was the tuner a local dyno shop, or one of our well known e-tuners? Did they offer any suggestions on what they felt was preventing boost from being generated? Do you know the WG spring pressure? How is the EBCS configured? Is the engine healthy? Good compression? Was KR preventing running higher boost, or just not generating boost pressure? Is the map locked, or can you open it in ATR? If not locked attach a copy of the map for review, and a couple of logs would help too.

Here is the map from the tuner. I don't have any software to open the PTM file maybe you could shed some light.

[mituc]

At this point your problem is the intake. You need a larger one.

[g00s3y]

Definitely need a 3" intake, 3.5" if you want. And get some e85/meth in there.

[Brando]

This is the intake that came with the car. It doesn't really say the size.
Mazdaspeed 3 SRI | Stage II Power Series Short Ram Intake

[sheston]

I browsed back thru the thread, but didn't really see where you said your goals are. If you don't want to or don't have E available, you could see fairly good gains from spraying some Meth. Your BATs are fairly high (I think you said you have the Corksport TMIC), and cooler air will get you some more flow. But then as pointed out above, you would be closer or even maxing out your intake.

If you haven't figure out by now, it's a game of chasing your tail. You add something to take away the bottleneck, and that just moves it to something else.... That's what makes these cars so fun

[MS3Shadow]

Originally Posted by Brando This is the intake that came with the car. It doesn't really say the size. Mazdaspeed 3 SRI | Stage II Power Series Short Ram Intake

That's stock sized.

sent from my Nexus 6P

[08cosmic3]

Tuning matters. Not sure what they charged you but an E-tune is cheap and the tuners here are the best, don't care how respected a local shop is they can't match the e-tuners here. Find your local Nator Chapter and seek their help and advise.

[mituc]

Originally Posted by Brando This is the intake that came with the car. It doesn't really say the size. Mazdaspeed 3 SRI | Stage II Power Series Short Ram Intake

The CS stage 1/2 intakes are stock sized. Their only advantage is that they come with cone filters which are more permissive than the factory ones. My Cobb SRI (which flows about 12% more than stock) was flowing 325g/s at 4.65V, in your case it's only 290g/s or so.

So get a 3" intake, there are some which should be easy to package under the hood without messing with the ECU or battery box.

[Brando]

Here's the data log. Car threw cel and said it was running rich. Looks like afr is up at 29.25 consistently and stft is compensating for it.
Going to pull it in tonight and glance around for leaks. Just thought I'd toss it out to you guys for comment/thoughts on common ms3 issues you've seen.

[blackms3_71]

If afrs are stuck at 29 then ur front o2 is done for.

[Madman2015]

Looks to me like a hose came loose but Im no expert. I wouldnt drive it until you get it figured out. Posting the CEL might help

[Brando]

the afr will move under boost but always resort back to 29.25

[blackms3_71]

So your saying even crusing around its at 29 ? Only time it should read 29 is when off the gas in deccel. Anything else and it should be 14.7ish or w.e your afrs are for wot.

[StevenW]

I'm running through a bunch of different threads with cars running the bnr s3 and guys are making a solid 60-75 more hp than the graphs above with a CS TIP or 3 inch intake. Seems like you need a better tuner and some e85 or WMI. A local guy was making 355 on 91, 370 on 91 and meth, and 404 on 91, meth, and e85 mix (WMI was just for cooling and not tuned as fuel). With the catted DP you would could probably aim for 10-15 whp less and at these power levels I'm not too sure if the stock CBE is restrictive.

[mituc]

The primary O2 is shot. Change it, you will be fine.

[MD1032]

Primary O2 is definitely done. Only reading 29 and 14.85 AFR. Amazing how short the lifespan on these things is. I just bought a new one the other day on sale to make sure I have a backup ready to go.