Dance Floor Destroyer

[Tomas]

The HTA3076 started making funny noises after the last track day. Checked shaft play and there was almost 1mm of it, So out it goes and in goes the GTX3071. Nothing exiting here except that about a week ago I was browsing ebay while intoxicated and came across the pumpkin below. With distillates flowing through one's veins and arteries my eyes became instantly watery and with a few clicks it is now moin. That's how easy it is. Not sure if smart or biggest imbecile ever. We'll see.

Hopefully this will encourage someone to produce T4 twin scroll manifolds suitable for both the 3 and the 6.

On one side 30 frame size ATP housed garret on the other EFR 7670.

The wastegate actuator canister on these things is fucking monstrous. The canister seems to be the only inconvenience so far fitting wise on the 3. As I understand it the 6 has more space between the engine and firewall so it might not be a problem there. The canister can be mounted almost on any location around the CHRA but the rod of the actuator will not reach the flapper even if you move it 2 holes down from stock location. The easiest solution that comes to mind would be to shorten the bracket and/or use a smaller OD canister commonly available anywhere. One can also fabricate a sort of "S" shaped threaded 1/4" pipe to connect the rod of the actuator to the flapper like ATP does but I personally don't like that. It's not very rigid and the shit flexes. At any rate, having to relocate the actuator is not a good enough reason not to use this terbow.

For fitting purposes I recommend an industrial 5 ton overhead crane.

And in you go.

I tried a few options to accommodate the wastegate canister in standard location. One tilted all the way toward the head and the other tilted at around 30 deg toward the firewall. Neither seemed satisfactory. And neither would serve a T4 divided manifold well.

Once I took the WG actuator off everything came together. And with the turbo pretty much in stock location. I suspended the tehrbaw below the stock manifold and it cleared everything just fine. Even with the EGR valve on although removing it would help immensely. As far as brake fluid reservoir, it is still fairly far from the compressor housing.

From below

Clearance

You will need to cut the coolant water pipe that goes on top of the transmission to gain clearance and replace it with hose. I had already done this for the HTA so the EFR went in nicely without impediment.

If I were to weld myself a manifold which I can't cuz I don't haz teh skillz I'd go with stock location. Just T4 divided of course. Simple as that. You can get away with leaving the EGR valve on but I would remove it. That frees up a lot of space. There is plenty of space to clear the alternator IMO with a 3" tight bend v-banded downpipe. The turbine housing is a 3.5" OD v-band which will accept a 3" pipe on the inside of the v-band flange. I measured almost 5" clearance which should be plenty.

To summarize, the following modifications are needed to fit this turbo:

1. Small battery or battery relocation.
2. Coolant pipe cut and hose extension below turbo.
3. Wastegate actuator bracket shortening and/or smaller canister or S shaped pie extension (least favorable)
4. EGR valve removal highly convenient but not indispensable.

[Lex]

Lol that's a monster. Spooling at 4300? I think so This should be interesting.

I like the emblem cooling mod btw!

[802MS3]

If I could click the Thanks button 100 times, I would.

I can't wait until some noob gets slaughtered for creating a new thread asking if anyone has tried to fit an EFR 7670.

"BRO. Didn't you see Tomas' Dance Floor Destroyer Thread? SEARCH FAGGOT!" lolol

[Tomas]

If one of these ever gets installed on an MZR you might be surprised how soon it spools. It's a 0.92 AR but BW hot side AR ratios are not the same as garret. The compressor wheel is about the same size as a GTX3076. The turbine is a bit larger but given that it's titanium aluminide it's supposed to be about half the weight of Inconel.

I don't think it's unreasonable to assume this turbo can make 18 psi at 3500 rpm.

[Lex]

Originally Posted by Tomas If one of these ever gets installed on an MZR you might be surprised how soon it spools. It's a 0.92 AR but BW hot side AR ratios are not the same as garret. The compressor wheel is about the same size as a GTX3076. The turbine is a bit larger but given that it's titanium aluminide it's supposed to be about half the weight of Inconel. I don't think it's unreasonable to assume this turbo can make 18 psi at 3500 rpm.

I've looked at their turbine design and it is impressive. The blade curvature is more pronounced versus the Garrett turbos changing how much torque the turbine sees versus exhaust flow through it.

What are the goals for this the build with this bad boy?

Also what WG actuator spring do you have installed?

[Tomas]

IF I ever get a EM for it I would probably just be limited by fuel. If I there is a solid PI solution at some point then I don't think 500-550 whp is a something this turbo could not handle for track duty. It would probably go on the 6 since that much power on the 3 is silly.

[djuosnteisn]

My 8374 has 20 psi before 4k rpm in 4th gear on the 6, and i'm a mile high in elevation. I have no doubt the 7670 would be an awesome performer.



Trying to shoe-horn it into stock location would be a bit difficult still IMO. Definitely not impossible... but not exactly easy either.

Is an EWG version an option Tomas? If so, that free's up a considerable amount of clearance near the alternator, and it becomes much more practical.


I'm building a motor for the 3 next week, and then going to be starting on an EFR build for it as well. I'm not gonna try for stock location though... too mundane for me. Instead, i'll be taking the sidewinder approach:




It's quite common on the hondas, and lend itself very nicely to bracing against the bell-housing.
(much like this, though i wouldn't orient the turbo quite like that)



I haven't torn into my 3 yet, but at first blush, it looks like there will be ample room for a down pipe once the battery box is out of the way.

[Tomas]

Originally Posted by djuosnteisn Is an EWG version an option Tomas? If so, that free's up a considerable amount of clearance near the alternator, and it becomes much more practical.

It's an option. But a less desirable one than the flapper on the EFR TS hot housings. You would need 2x EWGs and corresponding pipes on the EM and DP. It's just a lot more work and money for something that will end up as less reliable. I understand for street use this is not a major issue but for track duty it's a lot of additional things that can break down reducing reliability. The EFR twin scroll housing is really a work of art.

[djuosnteisn]

Originally Posted by Tomas It's an option. But a less desirable one than the flapper on the EFR TS hot housings. You would need 2x EWGs and corresponding pipes on the EM and DP. It's just a lot more work and money for something that will end up as less reliable. I understand for street use this is not a major issue but for track duty it's a lot of additional things that can break down reducing reliability. The EFR twin scroll housing is really a work of art.

Not only for reliability issues... but IWG is also quiet too. For the 3, i would actually prefer it over twin ewg's. I don't want the 3 to be some crazy race car... i already have one of those.

When i finally start ripping shit out of the 3's engine bay, i'll see how feasible an EFR IWG approach would be. If there's adequate room to still route a down pipe (and i really think there will be), i'd be completely okay with the longer turbine version of the turbo. I'll probably be going with a 7064 though.

[Tomas]

Yes yes. Doet.

The sidewinder approach is feasable but shit dood, the spool up with them long pipes is going to be slow. The runner from cylinder 1 to the flange will probably be over 2 feet long. And the heat from all that pipework. Muy caliente.

[Tomas]

I was going to wait till the build was ready but you got me all excited to spill the beans. lol.
Stock location. That bend can be made even tighter without pie cutting the elbow. And you can also move the collector an inch toward the drivers side. You haz the proof. Now Do it.

[SLOWHATCH]

Originally Posted by Tomas Yes yes. Doet. The sidewinder approach is feasable but shit dood, the spool up with them long pipes is going to be slow. The runner from cylinder 1 to the flange will probably be over 2 feet long. And the heat from all that pipework. Muy caliente.

Custom heatshields ftw? I mean , since we're going all out here. Although I hate to see all that pretty pipe work covered up on a sidewinder set up.

[djuosnteisn]

Originally Posted by Tomas Yes yes. Doet. The sidewinder approach is feasable but shit dood, the spool up with them long pipes is going to be slow. The runner from cylinder 1 to the flange will probably be over 2 feet long. And the heat from all that pipework. Muy caliente.

The runners won't be that long when it's all said and done. Take your cp-e mani, unravel the runners, and i bet it would damn near reach a sidewinder location as is. Plus, twinscroll FTW.

Only thing i'd be all that concerned about heat-wise would be the master cylinder reservoir, and that's an easy fix. I've already built a setup that routed a down pipe on the driver's side of the car (with stock battery box even), and it was a breeze. Tons of room:







Once the battery is relocated, and ecu shoved off to the side, it should be even better.


Like i said though... i haven't looked into to it with a fine-tooth comb... it's just an idea still at this point.

[BigRedSpecial]

Whenever I hear 'Twinscroll' I get boost in my pants.