Going BT.Possible to control Boost creep w/o EWG?

[bean59]

Hi hows it going everyone. I recently decided to take the BT plunge as bolt on's are just not cutting it anymore. I was looking at the ATP gt3076r since its a direct bolt-on but was worried about controlling boost creep. I had this problem on my k04 b/c of the straight pipe exhaust but was able to tune it out. I read that atp turbos have bad hotsides that need to be ported in order to control boost creep on IWG.

So do I really need an EWG to control boost creep or would I be able to tune it out on the IWG. My target psi would be around 23-24psi on that turbo. I'm still doing my research but I remember reading that the map sensor gets maxed out right around that psi so I'm guessing that might interfere in some way.

[sidekick]

IIRC, it was the EWG version that had creep issues due to the EWG inlet not flowing enough exhaust.

[jdmage_mx5]

With my 3071 research it seemed hit or miss with IWG and creep. I personally do not have that issue but I read a few threads were people had to port them some.

[Code Monkey]

You can upgrade the map sensor, read more.

[bean59]

Originally Posted by Code Monkey You can upgrade the map sensor, read more.

So 3 bar map sensor would be a must. I didn't want to do the EWG since I would have to change the manifold and if I can control it on an IWG might as well to safe some cash.

I was going to get some meth, convert to fmic, built engine, ebcs. I have 94 octane but no ethanol where I live. Do guys think shooting for 400hp is achievable or do I need a couple more things? Thanks for the help

[Code Monkey]

For the speed6 I would build the engine for a reliable 400whp and yes, you will need meth or maybe 3-4 gallons of race fuel to the tank may do the trick. You can have an EWG on the turbo hot side and run the stock EM. Search around for the oil drain line problems on the speed6, it is a bitch and you will have to go custom.

[sidekick]

Originally Posted by Code Monkey For the speed6 I would build the engine for a reliable 400whp and yes, you will need meth or maybe 3-4 gallons of race fuel to the tank may do the trick. You can have an EWG on the turbo hot side and run the stock EM. Search around for the oil drain line problems on the speed6, it is a bitch and you will have to go custom.

If only CP-E would sell their oil drain line from the Atmosphere kit, we might have something available...

[Code Monkey]

Originally Posted by sidekick If only CP-E would sell their oil drain line from the Atmosphere kit, we might have something available...

Hahahaahhahhhahhahhhahhahhhahahhahahahhahhahhahhha haaahahaahahhahhaha!!!!!! Throw in the modified crash bar while we're at it.

[bean59]

Originally Posted by Code Monkey For the speed6 I would build the engine for a reliable 400whp and yes, you will need meth or maybe 3-4 gallons of race fuel to the tank may do the trick. You can have an EWG on the turbo hot side and run the stock EM. Search around for the oil drain line problems on the speed6, it is a bitch and you will have to go custom.

That's the oil drain line underneath the turbo rite? When I removed my turbo I just left it bolted to the engine b/c I stripped one of those tiny screws. Should be lots of fun getting that off.

The other option I was looking at was if it would possible to say buy a turbo from a website like this 450-600HP | Rebuilt Turbos | Used Turbos and make it fit in the 6. Would that be possible by swapping the hotside for one from ATP so it bolts up to my dp, assuming I buy the t3/t4 EM. Would it be possible to buy the manifold and then an exhaust flange that will the fit the turbo and just weld it onto my dp? Some of these turbos look like they might fit onto a v-band flange. This is hoping that none of these turbos have clearance issues.

[Boost_creep]

I just received my GTX3071R kit the other day. I ordered it from Edge, but it shipped right from ATP. I was pleasantly surprised to find that the IWG passage was revised. No more of that "crescent" shaped obstruction. Looks like somebody was listening.

I plan to install it real soon, and I will try running spring pressure, too see how boost behaves. If interested, I can keep you posted.

[bean59]

Originally Posted by Boost_creep I just received my GTX3071R kit the other day. I ordered it from Edge, but it shipped right from ATP. I was pleasantly surprised to find that the IWG passage was revised. No more of that "crescent" shaped obstruction. Looks like somebody was listening. I plan to install it real soon, and I will try running spring pressure, too see how boost behaves. If interested, I can keep you posted.

Yeah let me know how your build goes. You have a cat in your exhaust so I wouldn't think you should have any creep issues. When I put a cat in my exhaust it fixed my over boosting issues, but I took it off b/c it really muffled the sound of the turbo spool. I was hoping atp revised something by now.

[Code Monkey]

I think EFR turbos don't have a creep issue?

[08cosmic3]

Only the older GT's have the creep issue, should be OK with a GTX.

[mtosofsky]

Only the older GT's have the creep issue, should be OK with a GTX.

Errrrrr...my gtx3076 was ported and creeped like all hell. Hitting 22psi on a 14psi wastegate.
@bean59; if you can afford to go ewg or just wait a bit longer to save up more, i'd go ewg. I understand that not everyone had the same misfortune with iwg that i had, and i was one of those skeptics that said i dont want ewg with the obnoxious dump noise. But god damn...that noise is addicting now.

Forgot to add something.....efficiency is key and does wonders. Yes the stock manifold is easiest and least expensive, but it makes the engine work harder to produce the power. I have a gtx3076 and cp-e manifold and my car is making 400whp very easily compared to people that i know using the stock manifold. Granted i have a 3 not a 6.

[bean59]

Originally Posted by mtosofsky Errrrrr...my gtx3076 was ported and creeped like all hell. Hitting 22psi on a 14psi wastegate. @bean59; if you can afford to go ewg or just wait a bit longer to save up more, i'd go ewg. I understand that not everyone had the same misfortune with iwg that i had, and i was one of those skeptics that said i dont want ewg with the obnoxious dump noise. But god damn...that noise is addicting now. Forgot to add something.....efficiency is key and does wonders. Yes the stock manifold is easiest and least expensive, but it makes the engine work harder to produce the power. I have a gtx3076 and cp-e manifold and my car is making 400whp very easily compared to people that i know using the stock manifold. Granted i have a 3 not a 6.

Yea I will probably just end up buying some sort of t3 manifold. Any recommendations on a good company? I've seen some pop up in the for sale section but they sell pretty quick. Another thing I was wondering was around what hp is the limit of the stock fuel system with just HPFP internals. When should you start thinking about changing the fuel pump/fuel rail?

[skiptowncat]

Creeping with my gtx3071, hitting 21 psi in 4th and 5th with 0 wgdc. I already have a cat welded in so I'm gonna have to look at something else to control it.

[Boost_creep]

Originally Posted by skiptowncat Creeping with my gtx3071, hitting 21 psi in 4th and 5th with 0 wgdc. I already have a cat welded in so I'm gonna have to look at something else to control it.

Roughly when was this turbo purchased?
Did you happen to inspect the IWG passage?

[skiptowncat]

Originally Posted by Boost_creep Roughly when was this turbo purchased? Did you happen to inspect the IWG passage?

About 2 months ago, didn't inspect it. Went straight to the guy who built my engine.

[mtosofsky]

Yea I will probably just end up buying some sort of t3 manifold. Any recommendations on a good company? I've seen some pop up in the for sale section but they sell pretty quick. Another thing I was wondering was around what hp is the limit of the stock fuel system with just HPFP internals. When should you start thinking about changing the fuel pump/fuel rail?

AFI can make you a t3 manifold if thats what you really want. And as far as fueling, you'll get no benefit of running a larger in tank fuel pump unless you are going to run port injection. Also there is no fuel rail upgrade for our car and you cannot get larger injectors either. So realistically, my car as an example, on just 93 octane i got stuck at 350whp. I run meth injection so that is where i get my extra fueling. Your extra fueling options are: run a couple gallons of e85, 5th/6th port injection, port injection intake manifold (JMF), or meth injection. Also, if you try and go e85 on big turbo, you'll just use up your injectors (IDC) more quickly and be running them way too hard.

[MS6_Newb]

I have no boost creep issues with my gt3071 IWG. Also the drain is a PITA mainly cause the studs are to short so message ATP for longer drain studs like I did. This saves a lot of frustration. Also the feed line needs a little massaging. Also to install the feed line stuff the socket full of paper towel, you'll see why when you do it. You must get a 3 port and 3 bar map then a tune.

[JDMCRX]

I just did a gt30 install and atp supplied studs that reduced in size and worked good . Bolted right up

[Alpha]

No creep whatsoever with the EFRs... That'd be great if ATP finally revised their IWG passage to help the bolt on GT guys though.