Top mount turbo setups

[djuosnteisn]

Fuck working on turbo in the stock location.

I'm limited in the turbo size i can run... I honestly don't even think a 3076 would fit, cause the 3071 is already kissing the head. My back is killing me, and my knees hurt from standing with them locked while i snake wrap my left hand through all four runners and spend 45 minutes trying to start one stupid bolt. I'm tired of having to put a pry bar in my compressor outlet to pull the turbo around (cause yes, it's that tight of a fit) to thread in one more 45 minute bolt. And I'm not happy with having to pull the mani just to take the turbo out, which is something i'm gonna want to do a lot more in the future as i experiment with different setups.

I'm just tired of this shit.

I want a setup that takes just a couple hours to work on, cause god knows, with a highly modified car, there's always something to work on.


So i wanted to get some thoughts from you guys of what considerations to take.


Like should i place the turbo right above the head like su mark & ssinstaller? Should i wrap my mani off to the driver's side like DCR-ish & vivid and put the turbo where the battery used to be?

What is the best type of line to use to replace the coolant and oil feeds/returns?



I got a call from my machinist today, and my new motor is almost finished. So as soon as i get it, i'm gonna assemble the long block and use it as my test jig for this new setup, and i'm just gonna build everything myself. I think my stainless steel skills are good enough at this point. But i wanted to get the BT community's opinion of things to consider while designing.


List so far:
- Easy as shit to work on. Easy to reach all exh mani bolts, and turbo -> mani flange bolts, plus oil & coolant feed & return.
- T3
- V-band from collector to turbo flange, just like the original DCR concept, so changing flange options is easy.
- Recirc'd dump tube, cause running a long ass dump tube puts alot of strain on the mani IMO. And i wouldn't mind quiet for a while.
- Possible 2-piece down pipe? Both with a flex section? how bad do flex sections hurt flow? This also would let me run a tapered 3.5" v-band in the future if i ever wanted to.
- Lot's of bracing to relieve / distribute stress on welds on the mani.


What gauge tubing should i use? I have a bunch of 2" pipe here already, and it's 1/16" wall (almost 14 gauge). It feels just as thick as any of the mani's i've run thus far, if not thicker.

Let the ideas roll. I want this to be the last turbo setup i have to do on this car

[idaners7]

so what turbo is good to get on my ms3

[madvillain]

Call creative man, that's who made sumark and ssinstaller's mani and downpipe, shit is sexy, and a decent price if I remember correctly. I know how you feel though man, I bet its a real bitch with that dcr manifold, you have a lot longer, more entangled runners than mine. I think I will have permanent knee damage from bending over this fucking car every week trying to screw with something behind the block.

[djuosnteisn]

hahahaha, seriously, mazda is gonna get sued for knee surgeries in like ten years.


Actually the DCR i'm running isn't the same as his first version. It's alot more straight forward:







But it's still stock turbo location, and i hate it.

[06Speed6]

Ide place it above the head.

[MATT DAMOND]

I'd do it up and above the head vs. at the battery. Mainly, since a DP seems easier to make and route that way. I'd make sure to do a bit of heat wrapping on the hotside and quite a lot of heat shielding on the VC and hood.

As for oil and coolant lines, SS braided teflon hose for the oil lines, and either SS braided rubber, or silicone hose for the coolant lines. Depending on the size of the lines, I'm sure I could help you out there. I haz lots of hoes.

[kore2000]

I love the top mount manifold on my car. I wouldn't have done it any other way. There was plenty of room and the DP/VTA tube was hella easy to route. The only issue I had was that my motor rocked so much that it dented the firewall, but I could seriously care less about that. I don't know too much about the thickness or the metal they used (SS I believe), just that the guy that built mine (Mike) said it was covered for life against cracks so I didn't worry too much.

One piece of advice that I'm really glad I did, get the damn mani, DP, and turbo ceramic coated because the top mounts generate a lot of heat when run hard.

[xcoldricex]

do you have a 3 or a 6 kore2000? i haven't seen a 3 with a top mount yet.

[kore2000]

I've got a 6. I'll see if I can take a pic with the cell phone today of my current setup as it sits on my car.

[xcoldricex]

is there enough room for a top mount for a 3?

[the_caruch]

I'd go with it above the head like Mark did too. Maybe a dumb question but would it be too close to the hood to cause heat problems?

You always do badass things djuosnteisn. And whatever you decide will be no exception.

[gtarman77787]

i say put it in the back seat of your car
i'm pretty sure someone on MSF did that actually...

oh
oh wait... it got stolen
yeah... alright sorry -- bad suggestion


trunk maybe?

[holeinmypocket]

Originally Posted by idaners7 so what turbo is good to get on my ms3

GTFO use the search button.....then determine what you goals are...seriously though GTFO of this thread NOOB

some vendor needs to just make a TM Mani....even if it's only 5 to start out with...they would sell like hot cakes

[ReD BoY]

eh...

[MS3-a(sore)ASS-rex]

I likethe battery turbo location actually. Besides fabbing the mani and dp which I'm sure would suck, getting to the turbo in the future would be cake

[Fagwagon]

Dj, go with the side mount like conso got done. If you can do it yourself, you will save a lot of money, to me when it mounts right up on the head it still looks kinda eww.

The side mount is a lot more work but i think you will like it better in the long run!

[www.cp-e.com]

Originally Posted by idaners7 so what turbo is good to get on my ms3

t6 88mm

DUSTIN: I'll email you a few pics when I get home.

[gtarman77787]

Originally Posted by www.cp-e.com t6 88mm DUSTIN: I'll email you a few pics of my weiner when I get home.

fixed

[integrrac]

someone plz just cut a hole in the hood already?

[ReD BoY]

Originally Posted by gtarman77787 fixed

hahahahahaha DRE FACE!

[integrrac]

[djuosnteisn]

Originally Posted by MATT DAMOND I'd do it up and above the head vs. at the battery. Mainly, since a DP seems easier to make and route that way. I'd make sure to do a bit of heat wrapping on the hotside and quite a lot of heat shielding on the VC and hood. As for oil and coolant lines, SS braided teflon hose for the oil lines, and either SS braided rubber, or silicone hose for the coolant lines. Depending on the size of the lines, I'm sure I could help you out there. I haz lots of hoes.

Great ideas. I'll def make a heat shield that sits between the turbo and valve cover. It'll let me get a lil creative too, haha. And i'll use a turbine boot or w/e their called, but like a snuggie for the hotside. And probably get everything coated as well, as kore suggested. As for the hood, i guess i could attach some of that thermal tape stuff, i dunno, i'll have to think on it a bit more.

I'll definitely lean on your for some help with the hoes

We all knowz you the hoz master.



I'll post some mock up pics once i get the long block assembled.


I know DCR used mild steel for all the flanges, so i'll probably just copy him i guess. I'm not sure stainless is necessary, and it would get pricey quick.

[Lex]

So what about this cast manifold from CPE? That's supposed to be the tightest fit ...

Just make sure you brace the big snail wherever you mount it.

[MS3-a(sore)ASS-rex]

Since you brought this cast cp-e manifold up, do you have any idea on a release date for that thing? It'd save me a hell of alot of time.

[djuosnteisn]

AFAIK I think they're lining there ducks up on what approach to take.

Tooling around with ideas anywhere from a full turbo solution (basically a single setup big power, like you see on some other platforms, hefty price tag, but probably cheaper than doing it in a modular fashion like we've all been doing thus far), all the way down to just a normal stock placement manifold, but with superior form / fit / function.



I think it's probably obvious what direction i'd like to see them take lol, but in the end they'll end up catering to the larger market, which doesn't exactly = dustin.

[MarkyMark]

just do it like mine dude. My turbo comes of in literally 3 min and the manifold off in 20, Intake takes 30 seconds. I'll just have a filter now cuz I am changing the car to blow through

But seriously, it will cut your work time in half, and look sick. Vband the downpipe and that's a 5 min job to remove too.

[gtarman77787]

i love the "smart" that goes on in this thread

seriously makes me consider BT

[djuosnteisn]

Done and done.... how about you post some pictarz so i know what exactly to do lol.

Originally Posted by StreetUnitMark just do it like mine dude. My turbo comes of in literally 3 min and the manifold off in 20, Intake takes 30 seconds. I'll just have a filter now cuz I am changing the car to blow through But seriously, it will cut your work time in half, and look sick. Vband the downpipe and that's a 5 min job to remove too.

.

[madvillain]

Noob question.. but is there any downsides, in terms performance, to having longer runners like on a side mount manifold? I forgot you had a welder in your garage dustin... do something like that crx, shit would be bananas

[djuosnteisn]

Hahahahaha, fuck that shit, i'm not gonna go that stupid. I just want to make my life easy.

Longer runners typically = a lil better torque down low, but less overall flow. But on a turbo setup, that effect is diminished AFAIK. Short and fat is ideal IMO. And placing the turbo right above the valve cover seems perfect. The mani would be very simple to build.


As soon as i get my long block assembled, i'll get started. I'll tack it all up first and get more opinions from you guys

[SSinstaller]

The wastegate sucks to pull off, but the intake,turbo, and DP can be removed in about half an hour.. Top mount is definitely the way to go...

[MS3-a(sore)ASS-rex]

And then mass produce these manifolds so that we can haz teh fastz too?

[djuosnteisn]

SS, how does your mani sound? It looks like all your runners are pretty damn equal length, which is ideal for spool up, but i kinda like the bubbly sound i get from my unequal length runners.

I know that my lengths aren't that different, but they definitely give some bubble to the rumble. I may intentionally exaggerate the unequal lengths, just for kicks.



Absolutely perfect. Thanks so much for the pics man!

[RacingToaster]

SS that setup looks good although the welds on that mani look kinda....well...

[SSinstaller]

Originally Posted by djuosnteisn SS, how does your mani sound? It looks like all your runners are pretty damn equal length, which is ideal for spool up, but i kinda like the bubbly sound i get from my unequal length runners. I know that my lengths aren't that different, but they definitely give some bubble to the rumble. I may intentionally exaggerate the unequal lengths, just for kicks. Absolutely perfect. Thanks so much for the pics man!

The mani sounds like most other boosted 4 cylinders--no burble to speak of...

The intake is tight on the brake reservoir, but it clears by about .5".

Originally Posted by RacingToaster SS that setup looks good although the welds on that mani look kinda....well...

Yeah, they're not the prettiest I've ever seen, but they're VERY VERY thick, and I have no doubt's about this manifold holding up...

[djuosnteisn]

Fuck pretty if it holds.

The weld that broke on my mani after 1 week of abuse was a very very pretty weld... just didn't penetrate very well. "Stack of dimes" doesn't work if the dimes are literally laying on top of the material being welded lol.

[turbospeed]

that setup is huge compared to stock

[madvillain]

Originally Posted by djuosnteisn Short and fat is ideal IMO.

So you're generally a fan of mexicans? I have a mexican friend who they call 'Pepsi Can' if you know what im saying.

[SneakyP86]

Go top mount man all that length of the runners for the side mount just sounds like trouble in the long run to me. I had a fabricator lined up to make some like the one I have but at the time couldn't get anyone to say they were interested. It was about the same time everyone was so gung ho over the Medeivel manifold (so hows that working out for you guys LMAO). I'm thinking of getting some type of GTO racing scoops on my stock hood near the back of the hood to help dissipate some of that heat. Don't really think you'd need that heat shield on the valve cover but if you want some extra insurance theres got to be a better way as I think that would look pretty shitty myself.

[MarkyMark]

Does this help?